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That’s Not OCD, You’re Just a Slacker

Of all the random pictures floating about the internet that I’ve run into in the past few weeks, this is the one that really got me:

Psychology multiple-choice question where the correct answer is written in:

Here’s the text:

A 23-year old medical student makes lists of all the tasks that he must accomplish each day. He spends hours studying and refuses to go out with his colleagues even when there are no tests on the immediate horizon, preferring to spend his time looking at specimens in the laboratory. He keeps meticulous notes during all his classes and prefers to attend every lecture, not trusting his colleagues to take notes for him. He is doing well in school and has a girlfriend who is also a medical student. Which of the following disorders does this student most likely have?

A. OCD
B. Obsessive-compulsive personality disorder
C. Obsessive-compulsive traits
D. Schizoid personality disorder
E. Paranoid personality disorder

[and written in] F. Fuck you, that sounds totally normal. Asshole.

Even I, Mr. Bon Vivant, have turned down outings to do the computer programming equivalent of “looking at specimens in the laboratory”, and you know what? It paid off in spades.

The medical student in this essay question doesn’t have obsessive-compulsive disorder, it’s just that in the age of slackerdom and ADD, diligence and focus looks like OCD. The question is also a sign of the greatly mistaken notion of the primacy of talent. Yes, talent is important and can give you an edge, but a whole body of studies shows (as does centuries of observation from pundits of all stripes) that in the long run, effort trumps talent. As I should say more often, “The harder I work, the luckier I get.”

If you’d like to read more about how effort trumps talent, take a look at Malcolm Gladwell’s Outliers, K. Anderson Ericsson’s The Making of an Expert and this bit of advice from Vince Lombardi:

The price of success is hard work, dedication to the job at hand, and the determination that whether we win or lose, we have applied the best of ourselves to the task at hand.

As for making lists and preferring to take your own notes, I think they’re the best way to stay organized and to learn.

Finally, the medical student in the question is at least sociable enough to have a girlfriend. The fact that she’s also in med school shouldn’t be a surprise: in university, you’re quite likely to date someone who’s in the same field of study as you.

So bravo, unknown psych student with a blue pen. The authors of that textbook may think you have the wrong answer, but you just passed the only test that matters. I salute you with a filet mignon on a flaming sword!

This article also appears in The Adventures of Accordion Guy in the 21st Century.

186 replies on “That’s Not OCD, You’re Just a Slacker”

I don’t want to be critical, I just want to point out that the med student in the question doesn’t have OCD as you suggest, he has OCPD (answer B), which is what the answer was suppose to be (I’m a med student and that is what I would have definitely answered). OCD and OCPD is not the same. The shortest way for me to explain OCPD is to think of an extreme perfectionist to the point that it is affecting that person’s life, most often socially. There is nothing wrong with working hard, making sure things are done right, etc. but this student was pathological. Although the question is not specific enough in detail, here is what it is trying to say. His “hours” of studying rather then being social when there is no test is unhealthy. I think we can all agree that there needs to be a balance between work and fun to be healthy. Nothing wrong with studying, but if he is studying all day and not socially functioning, that’s pathological. We humans are very social beings and being social is part of being healthy. Again, I do think this is a poorly written question because taking “meticulous” notes and attending every lecture rather than trusting friends to take notes does not quite qualify as pathological or socially dysfunctional. I think the writer of the question was using the word “meticulous” to try to convey this over the top perfectionist. Yes, he does have a girlfriend, but a socially dysfunctional person can still have a “girlfriend”, especially if they understand the rigors of medical school (we don’t know the status of the girlfriend either). So yes, not the best written question but the writer was going for OCPD here and barely qualifies it. It qualifies only that there seems to be some social dysfunction here. Sorry for the long post, I’m a med student and just wanted to clarify. I definitely agree with you that people don’t work hard anymore and anyone that does is looked upon as weird or worse. Sorry if I sound like an ass for correcting you, but I just couldn’t help but make sure people know the difference between OCD and OCPD.

Johnny, you’re pursuing a PhD yes? Because you have that missing-the-forest-for-the-trees problem endemic of PhDs.

A-fucking-men to the owner of the blue pen.

Okay, so the author can point out what he believes and be praised for it, yet someone else who actually is passionate about this stuff points out something simple, not to be rude, but just to inform, and you guys get to be giant assholes? Just calm down. You have “I’m on the internet and I think I’m cool” syndrome.

Yet again an intelligent person investing in science and loosing the ability to think for themselves. Thank you Johnny for telling us what your books have told you about ocd and ocpd try getting some real life experience instead of sitting in a classroom being told what to think and make up your own opinion. I attended University for Science and the only way I could have gotten through it is if I were like the student in the question, I had a rough family life growing up and was insecure and the only way I could have made it through school was to have support from my family and friends because I simply was not doing it for myself and on the other hand could not stand people at University who have never had to work a day in their life and everything was handed to them. I have a passion for science and kids in University are simply their for the wrong reasons, they get their grades do it half ass don’t care about subject matter and only car about their social life and popularity. You get the grades so you can get a job that pays well so you can buy things to make you happy. I study science to actually learn the tools/language so I can use them to benefit my community, my family and my friends. I only need myself to be happy, friends come naturally becuase I like people based on their personailty traits not on accomplishment or viewpoints on life. Now that I have realized my insecurities I am now doing the same thing as the man from the question above doing what I am passionate about and I no longer need others to accept it, just because I don’t seek attention and approval doesnt mean im OCDP or OCD thats a word telling me that I am not like normal people which great normal people are maroon’s, did you ever think my priorities in life are just straight? Your judging people by calling them OCD, you may be right in most cases this would show OCPD but you cannot make that assumption until you know the person and walk a mile in their shoes.

I think johnny is just pointig out what was expected to be the answer in the test not being critical or anything. Lets say now we have both sides of a story.

Yes, Johnny should know that only people who swears and challenge authorities are cool. We are so fucking awesome, oh yeah. See, I’m swearing right now. How amazing I am!

John-
Who says Johnny isn’t thinking for himself? Obviously there are exceptions to every instance and you may be one but he was just stating what the test writer was looking for. A multiple choice question on a test isn’t a forum for ones beliefs on the mis-diagnosis crisis we are experiencing. It is extremely presumptuous to say that Johnny is doing med school for the wrong reasons, who are you you to say? He was just stating the facts and your comments make you seem like a naive purist. Obviously your past has left a chip on your shoulder but please don’t berate and judge other people for stating the facts about the given data.

I would answer C – Obsessive Compulsive Traits. I work in neonatology, where being obsessive and compulsive are pretty much prerequisites to success. My favorite saying about it is “Being obsessive and compulsive are not disorders unless it interferes with your life. In my field, they help a lot!” ‘Cause I mean really, when you are dealing with babies that are 500g, do you really want people who are not obsessive and compulsive?

The guy in the question has a girlfriend, so he is maintaining social contacts, and isn’t being presented as impaired by his tendencies. The person answering the question is just being defensive. But it’s funny as hell.

What if the person thoroughly enjoys learning new things about his major/passion? If somebody’s totally into what they’re doing, I’m sure they want to and even enjoy learning as much about it as possible. Does that mean they have OCD? No. Is it unhealthy? No. People just want to put stupid ass labels on everything now-a-days.

Putting a negative label on positive and necessary traits for a med student seems counterproductive. (Maybe this guy had a Tiger Mother) I sure don’t want the person who took every moment of his perceived free time partying to be responsible for my brain surgery – I think I’d rather have the person who spent their time studying. Identifying every action that doesn’t fit within “normal” as an abnormal disorder speaks to the medical community’s incestuous relationship with drug companies. The mesage seems to be, “You’re different, but that’s OK… we have a pill for that!”

Johnny,
You are absolutely correct, I know many people with OCPD and the symptoms described in this textbook are spot-on. I couldn’t agree more!

I do not see this behavior as “pathological”. Depending on what school the student attends and what his future career goals are, this may actually be necessary behavior for success, especially if the student in question is not prone to do well in school without such discipline. If somebody opts to prioritize school over social life that is their prerogative. Lord, I wish MORE people cared about actually accomplishing something academic these days. Also, I just got out of nursing school, and it was pretty typical for girls in my class to cut back significantly on their social lives while classes were in session (I, alas, did not follow suite…). Why do we have to label every variation in lifestyle, personality, or preference as a disorder?

I would also like to point out that while we are all social creatures, the degree of social interaction we need on a day to day basis is highly individualized. I have many friends but I still prefer to spend many nights alone. I am introverted and time alone is relaxing and productive for me. Since the student in the passage is specifically mentioned to have a girlfriend, it is safe to assume he is getting some level of regular social interaction.

Great, it sounds more like OCPD than OCD. I don’t think the author really cared what disorder was being looked for because yeah, this sounds pretty normal. I know plenty of kids like this. A problem with the DSM-IV and that area is that people can be too quick to label someone as disturbed.

Is the answer C? It’s obsessive compulsive traits, right? Meaning… traits that make people seem like they have OCD?

Just saying.

Someone made up the question and answers. They created a scenario where the answer would be “F. perfectly normal”, and just placed for the answers other disorders that definitely wouldn’t apply to the question. Thus making the last answer a clever, funny answer.
So the above “photo” is not an actual question to some formal test. It was intentionally written to be funny.

There is a difference between a textbook hypothetical and real life. The situation is that text book authors operate in black and white. Life has color.

Yes Liz it is. The student isn’t experiencing any distress with his obsession for the little things. For it to be classified as a disorder the person needs to be experiencing distress and not wanting to obsess over things.

Ok, John is a fucking idiot. First of all, what is the University of Science? Seems like a pretty broad term to me…almost every college in America has a university for a branch or branches of science. Second off, I could barely comprehend what he wrote, it was so choppy and lacking of grammar. Third off, John’s treating the person in the question like he’s real, not hypothetical. This question was simply asking to identify traits of someone with OCPD. Maybe using a med student as an example isn’t a good idea, because med school does require so much effort and time. Oh, and keeping a girlfriend IS NOT the same as keeping social contacts. You all assume that because he has a girlfriend, he probably has friends, but he doesn’t have time for them. That’s not the case at all. He doesn’t spend any time trying to make any friends, because he’s studying all the time. Are you telling me that it’s normal for a med student to not spend any time being social? Because I’m going to have to stop you right there with a “bullshit”. There have been plenty of guys with girlfriends but no friends. Have you never seen “I Love You, Man”?

The correct answer is B. I didn’t know this, I would have chosen C, it sounds like a lesser version of B. But, upon a little research I found this website:

http://www.obsessivecompulsivetraits.info/

where you get to learn about what “obsessive compulsive traits” actually are. These describe those people who have recurrent ideas and fantasies as well as repetitive impulses or actions. Think “Aviator” and that’s exactly it.

Anyways, if I operated the way this hypothetical med student does I’d be dead from a heart attack. Relaxation has its merits. Everything in moderation, yada yada. So, in conclusion: Fuck John.

hahahaha go stumbleupon! but as entertaining as the comments are i worry that some people get a little too hot and bothered over the little things! it just a joke. if you disagree dont let it bother you just let it go(:

It’s ironic that John is being berated for simply trying to give information, but by also ACTUALLY doing what people are accusing him of. This website tried to say that the answer was the written in F. John took his own opinion, based on his own knowledge, and acknowledge the merits of the site’s perspective as well as the legitimate aspects of his education. At the least, he made it clear he was just trying to make a clarification about the disorders, and not trying to be an ass. Why must everyone get so upset at him for that?

And I’d agree with the person who says this looks like it was written as a joke. It looks like a couple of stressed out med students joking around… the picture appears to be on a piece of paper, not in a textbook.

Lot of chatter going on. I think John’s ego got shot somehow along the way. However, John I do agree with what you said regarding walking in someone else shoes’ before making an opinion, but it sounds like you made plenty opinions and possibly “self” stereotypes on the majority of academic students in the entire world! Hmm. Regardless, any doctor will “label” a random group of symptoms to sound entelligent like, OCD, OCPD, Firbromyalgia. In the end, only you decide if their opinion is accurate. I will agree, being influenced by others or letting others make your decisions for you only pushes you further from your true self and what a shame to live life not knowing the one person who matters, you!

@Sean: John wrote that he went to “University for Science,” not the “University of Science.”

If you look at the previous comments, someone recognized this as their actual test… so it wasn’t a joke. Plus you can tell its not just a “piece of paper” from a stressed out student, there is thickness to the book and theres print behind it. This argument reminds me of high school, it’s sarcastically refreshing to know this is what adults act like. Anyways, Johnny sounds like the “asshole” the guy with the blue pen was talking about in the photo…

I’m not a med student, I study media and mass comm.
I dont know the answer to the question. Nor do i care to pass comment on the perceived standards of normal behavior. However the ability to a simple picture to inspire debate thereby enabling people to compare and contrast individual perceptions and understandings of reality and thus celebrating the democracy enjoyed by those able to own computers, with access to the internet – is still very validating :)

Sean, come on now. With the mannerisms that John used when typing I am going to assume english was not his first language. For a non-native english speaker instead of saying “I am a Science Major”, and with his surrounding text implying that most sciences are more difficult than other college programs he stated “I attend University FOR Science”. Also, the question implies he is friends with his colleagues by making it sound like he is invited to go out with them.

How grammar proficient are you in the other language you know? I had no problem following what John said as long as I treated it like I was talking to someone from another country.

Everyone has something “wrong” with them… it’s totally natural. Nobody should be a perfectly functioning, idealistic personality specimen. It’s human to have a “disorder.”

Yeah, Johnny, your wrong. The student in the text makes a choice to not go out, it’s not that he is unable to from a mental disorder.
He is just really interested in his work and is working hard. Who says that your not mentally healthy if you don’t go out?
I don’t get out at all or have friends. I have acquaintances that are nice, but I work hard and I study hard, I just don’t feel the need to sit and watch T.V. or lazily scan the internet.
Focus or passion is not a disorder.

I’m amazed that almost all of you arguing in favor of the guy who wrote the question in the textbook claim to be university scholars. Apparently, you’ve never known anyone who went to med school. Med school is where you cut yourself off from the world and study from the time you wake up til the time you hit the sack for about 4 hours of sleep, if possible. Anyone who is serious about med school knows that even if you do have time to hang out with friends, you’re better off studying some more. It’s not OCD, there are no disorders, and if there were…fuck, I wish I had them! Buckle down more in school before you try to diagnose someone with OCD just because they know when to work hard and put their social life on the backburner. Getting a “B” in organic chemistry doesn’t fly if you want to actually make real money and have a real job after med school. Johnny, and your followers, take a look at your last report card and consider if that night out with your friends was worth the failed test that caused you to drop a letter grade.

Well… I’m not in med school. But I distinctly remember weeks where I maybe got 3 hours of sleep because I kept myself busy sketching, painting, and drawing. I filled 3 half inch sketch books- about half of the drawings from life, a giant water color pad, a giant paint pad, and about 20 canvas/loose paper/cardboard pieces that ranged from 3″x5″ to 8’x5, along with the already assigned classwork of about 15 sketch book pieces due every three weeks (oh yeah that pretty much filled up another sketchbook). I may have flirted with OCD like tendencies with the amount of detail I put in, but I still saw friends and may or may not have been slightly delirious during the day (still managed to pull a GPA of 3.8). I saw getting a 5 on my AP Portfolio worth it, as well as getting up to a 75% scholarship to some really nice art schools. But really, my argument fails for answer F because as soon as I found out nobody was willing to help me pay for what scholarships and grants wouldn’t cover without loans, I dropped out of high school and now I have my GED and am attending a school for Agriculture in Nebraska which has a city population of 800, 550 being students. Which ties in with my next argument: who the fuck cares where you go to school. The point is to better yourself. Obviously whoever made the comment about going to a/the “university for science” is trying there hardest to get out of whAt they’ve known all their life. Excuse them for not being able to go to Harvard. I’ll be going to a school in the middle of NOwhere, Nebraska that Nobody on here has probably never heard of (NCTA to be precise). Despite it’s small population, there’s knowledgable teachers willing to help, awesome clubs and activities, LOTS of animals so we actually get Hands on experience instead of straws filled with kool aid and a video on how to treat dystocia in a laboring heifer/cow, as well as amazing dorms and facilities to boot. Did I mention cheap as hell tuition? So don’t rag on somebody just because you’ve never heard of where someone is going.
Regarding the picture, kudos to The One Whom Yields the Blue Pen. Normal is about being abnormal. Everyone is wired just a little bit differently. Loud noises scare the shit out of me, but I don’t have PTSD.

While I can see what the textbook author is going for, he definitely went way too general and ended up just describing the top class med student; the question is a bad question. OCPD needs some signs that their striving for perfectionism is interfering with task completion or social relationships in a significant way. For example, having the guy go back and change his schedule of the day so that it exactly reflects, minute-by-minute what he did or having him rewrite a whole assignment written in pen because of a misspelling near the very end of the assignment would probably have helped this question to better fit the WHO guidelines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obsessive–compulsive_personality_disorder#WHO).

Yeah, i just scrolled all the way to the bottom without reading a single comment.
I’m certain they were boring. They always are. Net-heads have forgotten how to think.
Bunch of squawking chickens. Comments suck. They’re a waste of time. Good bye.

Well, that was enjoyable. Reading the comments actually made this article so much more interesting so thank you to all you angry internet syndrome heads and polite critics :L Personally I’d choose the answer C) because of his need to control eg. not trusting his colleges to take notes.

Everyone commenting on this that thinks that the guy in the question is normal has some sort of social disorder. Its probably because you were all bullied in school and found that books were your only refuge. Enjoy the internet as its most likely the only social interaction you get, and yes, I am a medical student just like johnny who would have picked OCPD.

Remember this salient point: psych diagnosis is lost in appearances anyway. Appearance labels are always arguable, based only on superficial criteria, and have only passing value in dealing with the neurophysiology of matters. DSM 4 is a compilation of phenotypes, not a registration of what we know about actual etiology and brain function.

The comment about OCPD “personality” is germane in this regard, implying that one free from affective conflict is also, by default, free of cognitive conflict, which likely is not the case with this person and many others who go unrecognized because almost no one asks about or considers impairment in cognitive function and don’t know how to assess it as they have no useful questions in that regard.

With modern brain investigations we are far more aware of cognition and the attendant challenges with thinking too much – and the therapeutic implications associated. I have a video on this subject that might be of interest… more than 6000 have found it of interest already:

So many of these folks, no matter their advanced degrees, have treatable ADHD – not ADHD by the current DSM 4, but OCD or OCPD symptoms on the surface driven by challenged executive function and working memory.

See what you think: http://youtu.be/fu0mN68rkEs
cp

I would like to point out that while indeed this is a poorly worded question, and it is absolutely great if you put quality time and effort into your education, it truly is unhealthy to spend all of your free time studying. Mental well being is concerned with social interactions, and devoting all of your time towards an intended career path is counterproductive. You can become a master at your chosen pursuit and still have some spare time for, you know, sleep. If you love studying that much, go for it. But you only live one life, and you should try to live in a way that makes you happy, not just live for the future.

How about this: there’s nothing “wrong” with OCD or OCDP when there are no damages.

ASD and ADHD co-morbid, hyper-focus kicked in.

Doesn’t like authority, manipulating people, being manipulated, hyper focus, needs to keep lists to remind him of stuff, strange? interests….

AKA Geek syndrome.

You may be interested to know ‘normal’ people are ignorant and don’t have enough brains to compensate.

Source:
http://www.biologicalpsychiatryjournal.com/article/PIIS0006322311000126/fulltext
http://www.jneurosci.org/content/31/18/6620

suck that.

Oh and mirror nuron problems:
http://www.ted.com/talks/vs_ramachandran_the_neurons_that_shaped_civilization.html

http://www.google.co.uk/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=aspergers+too+much+empathy

Possibly frontal lobe damage from being clouted round the head when younger causing ASPD / Psychopathic traits and calling other people disordered.

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